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	<title>Comments on: women: the undiscovered country</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blogs.feministsf.net/?feed=rss2&#038;p=337" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337</link>
	<description>Feminists blog about science fiction, speculative fiction, and fantasy. Books, movies, comics, games, reason, &#38; ranting.</description>
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		<title>By: DAS</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-165501</link>
		<dc:creator>DAS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2008 23:06:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-165501</guid>
		<description>Somewhat OT, but it&#039;s interesting how young the idea that &quot;every body part must be named after someone who &#039;discovered&#039; it&quot; (as if people didn&#039;t know about the part for years but just didn&#039;t think of naming it after someone) sinks into one&#039;s mindset.

When my young brother and I were kids (i.e. in elementary school), one of his favorite things to do to irritate me was to stick a cold piece of whatever (an ice cube, a chilled lego) down the back of my shirt.  One time he asked me how I liked it, to which I replied &quot;not in the least bit&quot;.

Except I was eating something at the time, so my mouth was full (c.f. &quot;heffalump&quot; from the Winnie the Pooh stories) and the words came out &quot;not in the Leisch pit&quot;.

Even as an elementary school kid, my brother figured that I meant I didn&#039;t like it particularly when something cold happened to fall into that pit between the shoulder blades (as if I would be ok with a piece of ice anywhere else) and that the pit was named after some anatomist named &quot;Leisch&quot;.

To this day, we still call that part of the body &quot;the Leisch pit&quot;.

*

OTOH, (and back on topic) isn&#039;t there a difference between &quot;colonization&quot; via naming things like &quot;the G-spot&quot; or &quot;Kegel excercizes&quot; or even &quot;Braxton Hicks contractions&quot;, which have been known to women for quite some time and names like &quot;Fallopian tubes&quot; for things not necessarily known to either women or men.  Certainly in the latter case, sexism was involved, but more in the general matter that certain careers used to be relatively closed to women?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Somewhat OT, but it&#8217;s interesting how young the idea that &#8220;every body part must be named after someone who &#8216;discovered&#8217; it&#8221; (as if people didn&#8217;t know about the part for years but just didn&#8217;t think of naming it after someone) sinks into one&#8217;s mindset.</p>
<p>When my young brother and I were kids (i.e. in elementary school), one of his favorite things to do to irritate me was to stick a cold piece of whatever (an ice cube, a chilled lego) down the back of my shirt.  One time he asked me how I liked it, to which I replied &#8220;not in the least bit&#8221;.</p>
<p>Except I was eating something at the time, so my mouth was full (c.f. &#8220;heffalump&#8221; from the Winnie the Pooh stories) and the words came out &#8220;not in the Leisch pit&#8221;.</p>
<p>Even as an elementary school kid, my brother figured that I meant I didn&#8217;t like it particularly when something cold happened to fall into that pit between the shoulder blades (as if I would be ok with a piece of ice anywhere else) and that the pit was named after some anatomist named &#8220;Leisch&#8221;.</p>
<p>To this day, we still call that part of the body &#8220;the Leisch pit&#8221;.</p>
<p>*</p>
<p>OTOH, (and back on topic) isn&#8217;t there a difference between &#8220;colonization&#8221; via naming things like &#8220;the G-spot&#8221; or &#8220;Kegel excercizes&#8221; or even &#8220;Braxton Hicks contractions&#8221;, which have been known to women for quite some time and names like &#8220;Fallopian tubes&#8221; for things not necessarily known to either women or men.  Certainly in the latter case, sexism was involved, but more in the general matter that certain careers used to be relatively closed to women?</p>
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		<title>By: Mickle</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147850</link>
		<dc:creator>Mickle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Apr 2008 01:59:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147850</guid>
		<description>I know it wasn&#039;t the &lt;i&gt;same&lt;/i&gt; Mary Lyon - and not a direct descendant either, since I believe she never married.  I was thinking a grand-niece or something like that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know it wasn&#8217;t the <i>same</i> Mary Lyon &#8211; and not a direct descendant either, since I believe she never married.  I was thinking a grand-niece or something like that.</p>
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		<title>By: Yonmei</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147490</link>
		<dc:creator>Yonmei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 18:43:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147490</guid>
		<description>&lt;I&gt;Are you thinking of Value Tales? Those were awesome.&lt;/I&gt;

I don&#039;t think so - at least, the books at the site you linked to bear no resemblance to the books I remember.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Are you thinking of Value Tales? Those were awesome.</i></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think so &#8211; at least, the books at the site you linked to bear no resemblance to the books I remember.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura Q</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147448</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura Q</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:55:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147448</guid>
		<description>... I don&#039;t think it can be the same Mary Lyon. Mary Lyon the biologist is still alive -- publishing as recently as a coupleo f years ago, I think.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230; I don&#8217;t think it can be the same Mary Lyon. Mary Lyon the biologist is still alive &#8212; publishing as recently as a coupleo f years ago, I think.</p>
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		<title>By: Mickle</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147444</link>
		<dc:creator>Mickle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:31:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147444</guid>
		<description>Hey! I wonder if your Mary Lyon was named after the Mary Lyon that founded Mount Holyoke College (then Seminary) or if it&#039;s just a coinky dink.

Yonmei

Are you thinking of &lt;i&gt;Value Tales&lt;/i&gt;?  Those were &lt;i&gt;awesome&lt;/i&gt;.  My sister and I both adored the one about Nellie Bly.  I do remember one about a female doctor named Elizabeth, but all I can find is &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.valuetales.com/books/kindness&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this one&lt;/a&gt; about &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Fry&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Elizabeth Fry&lt;/a&gt;.    I could be thinking of a different series from you, though.  Plus, they aren&#039;t all listed on that site.  It looks like they are reprinting them, but only have some of them out so far.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey! I wonder if your Mary Lyon was named after the Mary Lyon that founded Mount Holyoke College (then Seminary) or if it&#8217;s just a coinky dink.</p>
<p>Yonmei</p>
<p>Are you thinking of <i>Value Tales</i>?  Those were <i>awesome</i>.  My sister and I both adored the one about Nellie Bly.  I do remember one about a female doctor named Elizabeth, but all I can find is <a href="http://www.valuetales.com/books/kindness" rel="nofollow">this one</a> about <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Fry" rel="nofollow">Elizabeth Fry</a>.    I could be thinking of a different series from you, though.  Plus, they aren&#8217;t all listed on that site.  It looks like they are reprinting them, but only have some of them out so far.</p>
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		<title>By: Yonmei</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147282</link>
		<dc:creator>Yonmei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 22:28:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147282</guid>
		<description>There was a book (I cannot remember the publisher or the author) about Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, pioneering woman doctor, which gave a child&#039;s-eye view of her life story. I recall another in the same series on Louis Pasteur - I assume it was some kind of &quot;people&#039;s hero&quot; series for children. I had read both before I was twelve... certainly before I had myself consciously realised I was a feminist.

I like the theme of this post, btw.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There was a book (I cannot remember the publisher or the author) about Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, pioneering woman doctor, which gave a child&#8217;s-eye view of her life story. I recall another in the same series on Louis Pasteur &#8211; I assume it was some kind of &#8220;people&#8217;s hero&#8221; series for children. I had read both before I was twelve&#8230; certainly before I had myself consciously realised I was a feminist.</p>
<p>I like the theme of this post, btw.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura Q</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147199</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura Q</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 11:02:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147199</guid>
		<description>Ah - yes, she&#039;s amazing. &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/WandersonE.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Spartacus encyclopedia&lt;/A&gt; has more interesting details than &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Garrett_Anderson&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;wikipedia&lt;/A&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah &#8211; yes, she&#8217;s amazing. <a HREF="http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/WandersonE.htm" rel="nofollow">Spartacus encyclopedia</a> has more interesting details than <a HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Garrett_Anderson" rel="nofollow">wikipedia</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Yonmei</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147180</link>
		<dc:creator>Yonmei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 09:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147180</guid>
		<description>In context, I think Jennie must mean Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, who qualified to practice as a doctor via the Society of Apothecaries in 1865, but was not permitted to take a medical degree in England: she got her doctorate at the University of Paris some years later. (And the Society of Apothecaries changed their rules immediately after Elizabeth Garrett had sat their exam, ensuring that no other woman could take the same route.)

Elizabeth Garrett&#039;s younger sister Millicent was involved in the establishment of Newnham College at Cambridge and became  President of the National Union of Women&#039;s Suffrage Societies - the &quot;conservative&quot; wing of the feminist campaign to get women the vote, as opposed to the direct action methods of the Women&#039;s Social and Political Union. 

Millicent married a Liberal MP, also a feminist, Henry Fawcett: it is ironic that the National Union of Women&#039;s Suffrage Societies, which still exists as an organisation (it now campaigns on &quot;women’s representation in politics and public life; pay, pensions and poverty; valuing caring work; and the treatment of women in the justice system&quot;) was renamed &quot;the Fawcett Society&quot; rather than the &quot;Garrett Society&quot;...

PS: The London School of Medicine for Women was founded in 1874 by a group of women involved in medicine, including Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, Elizabeth Blackwell, and Sophia Jex-Blake. For many years Elizabeth Garrett Anderson was evidently regarded by the (male) British medical establishment as the big exception - she was allowed to join the British Medical Association, but they formally changed the rules as soon as they&#039;d let her in to make sure no other woman could follow her. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In context, I think Jennie must mean Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, who qualified to practice as a doctor via the Society of Apothecaries in 1865, but was not permitted to take a medical degree in England: she got her doctorate at the University of Paris some years later. (And the Society of Apothecaries changed their rules immediately after Elizabeth Garrett had sat their exam, ensuring that no other woman could take the same route.)</p>
<p>Elizabeth Garrett&#8217;s younger sister Millicent was involved in the establishment of Newnham College at Cambridge and became  President of the National Union of Women&#8217;s Suffrage Societies &#8211; the &#8220;conservative&#8221; wing of the feminist campaign to get women the vote, as opposed to the direct action methods of the Women&#8217;s Social and Political Union. </p>
<p>Millicent married a Liberal MP, also a feminist, Henry Fawcett: it is ironic that the National Union of Women&#8217;s Suffrage Societies, which still exists as an organisation (it now campaigns on &#8220;women’s representation in politics and public life; pay, pensions and poverty; valuing caring work; and the treatment of women in the justice system&#8221;) was renamed &#8220;the Fawcett Society&#8221; rather than the &#8220;Garrett Society&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>PS: The London School of Medicine for Women was founded in 1874 by a group of women involved in medicine, including Elizabeth Garrett Anderson, Elizabeth Blackwell, and Sophia Jex-Blake. For many years Elizabeth Garrett Anderson was evidently regarded by the (male) British medical establishment as the big exception &#8211; she was allowed to join the British Medical Association, but they formally changed the rules as soon as they&#8217;d let her in to make sure no other woman could follow her.</p>
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		<title>By: Laura Q</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-147116</link>
		<dc:creator>Laura Q</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Apr 2008 23:44:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-147116</guid>
		<description>Do you mean Elizabeth &lt;B&gt;Barrett&lt;/B&gt;-Browning? And what were her sisters to this post?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you mean Elizabeth <b>Barrett</b>-Browning? And what were her sisters to this post?</p>
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		<title>By: Jennie</title>
		<link>http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337&#038;cpage=1#comment-146881</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Apr 2008 00:04:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blogs.feministsf.net/?p=337#comment-146881</guid>
		<description>Elizabeth Garrett-Browning. And her sisters were pretty cool too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Elizabeth Garrett-Browning. And her sisters were pretty cool too.</p>
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